H : inside me, I feel very thankful to God, that I’ve got your sangat, Baba ji. I’m happy and can move on now spiritually…..


Baba Ji : First you were reading, now you’re tasting it.


H : Now I’m  living what I’ve been reading in the scriptures and in the lifestories of the saints and been dreaming of for so many years. 


Baba Ji : What does Guru Nanak say that "reading and reading other peoples expereinces you are merely loading your cart with books upon books." Bbut only by experiencing God do you really know Him.

It is better to put knowledge into practice than endless reading.  Experience is better, so go and do Zen for a month, THEN come and read the Granth. (Then you will better understand what the scriptures are saying).  But to truly understand gurbani you will still need a Saint) who will match it up and put it in order for you.

H :  Before I received Dassan Das ji’s e-mail nearly two years ago (2002), I was at a point where I was looking for something.  I didn’t want go back to the old (orthodox religious) way, and I didn’t have a new way.  But I knew I needed something.  I thought I’ll get all these positive thinking literature and I’ll make myself happier, do something at least, set some goals.  I was going to start a  programme of CDs a programme where you have 8 CD’s, you listen half an hour in the morning, like a self hypnosis thing.  The day I was going to start by listening to it in the car, I received Dassan Das Ji’s first e-mail and after that day I didn’t listen to them.  The CDs are still lying there, I spent 80 pounds on them and they are still lying there sitting in my draw, I never listened to them.   It’s like God saved me from going into something else. 

Baba Ji : Positive thinking gives you temporary relief.  But doesn’t matter what goals and plans you make, if its not in your karma you wont get them.  So better to accept God’s will and do Naam and realise the self.

H : Also a few weeks before at that time, I was just surfing the internet.  God does everything and I ended up reading this article written from an English person who became a Guru disciple.  He was talking about an event that happened about 20 years ago when he met his Guru for the first time in Oxford. He said, “The Guru was coming to England.  There was so much excitement.  We painted the house and when he came there was so much joy.  Everyone did simran together and they all had Naam.  In the end everyone was blissed out.” He used that phrase “blissed out.”   In my imagination I thought ‘wow’ that was amazing, I never experienced that, even though I did everything that a religious person i did.  I’ve never been to a sangat and been blissed out in the presence of a living Guru.   It must have been like that in the times of the past saints. 

God does everything, because after reading this, the seed was implanted and few weeks later Dassan Das Ji’s e-mail came.

But then I had all my doubts, because of the way I was programmed for the last 20 years by my religion and culture.   Then one by one with truth, I knocked them down.  Dassan Das Ji spent a lot of time and patience sending me e-mails, answering every little silly point, every stupid little thing, I just realised I wasn’t born with any of these beliefs. I said, “they can be changed, I was taught them, they will have to be untaught.  No point getting attached to any of it, theres no joy at the end of it.”
Baba Ji : Ritualism and symbolism is the diversity, otherwise all religion and Jyot (God’s light in each heart) is One (like one sun has many seasons, like one God has many religions).  The closer you get to Truth, you will let go of the religious head coverings and burn yourself (free your  mind from all attachments, rituals and symbols that you are wearing and doing in the name of God) and throw away the relgious uniforms and symbols too.           
This is the definition of the fifth and highest realm (Sach Khand – realm of Truth) :
‘God has no colour, no form and no costume’   – Guru Gobind Singh Ji .
If God is  Formless and has no external costume or markings, then why do you say this religious identity is His special form?
Do you understand what I’m saying?

H :  Yes.  Everyone’s wandering lost in a dark room of their own fears.  They attack other people, but its actually due to their own insecurities, their own weaknesses.  Its our own weakness, we project your own weakness on others  (want to blame others, dont want to accept its our own filthy mind that is the enemy , not others).

One of my teenage friends has got a lot of  love for God, she is strict religious person but I can see she is a dead-end in terms of spiritual progress like I was before I met my first saint Gurmukh ji ten years ago.  Everytime I see her I say to her that you need to get under the guidance of a saint, as it will help you so much, she said that she doesn’t know anyone.  I said to her that you have to pray and ask God for a guide.  Also said to her that ‘are you ready to accept that a saint could be beyond religion –  he could even be from a different spiritual tradition?”   But she never replied to that one.   On one side they are crying and on the other side they are not ready to open minded.
Baba Ji :  They are enclosed in this, this ‘my ancestors’ ,’my ancestors religion’.   It is a sickness for the moment.   What over powers the moment?  Past.  What worries the moment?  Future.  What does the Bani tell you to do?  Forget them both.  But we don’t want to forget them, because that’s how the addiction of the brain is.
The brain is like a sponge.  It collects from all around, and the centre part bubbles up.  It goes like a fountain, and the centre part bubbles up.  Alpha and beta brain waves.  He (God) is Alpha, Omega and Beta Himself.   If He’s the Alpha, Beta, Omega Himself, then HE is the brain and the brain waves.  He is the Mind.
What is Man-Sarover (Universal Mind-Ocean)?  Its cosmic conscious.  What is cosmic conscious? That which runs the mind.  (i.e God Himself is the Universal Mind that runs all our minds.  He is the Mind-Ocean (Man-sarovar, we are the mind-drops)).