Ik Oankaar Sat Naam Satgur Parsaad
Dhan Dhan Gur-Guru-Satgur-Gurbani-Sat Naam-Sat Sangat
Kottan Kot Dandaut Parvaan Karna Ji; Gur Fateh Parvaan Karna Ji
With the Anant Beyant Gur Kirpa Gur Parsaad we are trying to dedicate following Seva at the Shree Charans of Dhan Dhan Guru and Dhan Dhan Akal Purakh and Dhan Dhan Sat Sangat Ji:
SHABAD “VAHIGURU” DIVINE MEANING
sathijug sathigur vaasadhaev vaavaa vishanaa naam japaavai
dhuaapar sathigur hareekrishan haahaa har har naam dhhiaavai
thraethae sathigur raam jee raaraa raam japae sukh paavai
kalijug naanak gur gobi(n)dh gagaa govi(n)dh naam japaavai
chaarae jaagae chahu jugee pa(n)chaaein vich jaae samaavai
chaaro(n) ashhar eik kar vaahiguroo jap ma(n)thr japaavai
jehaa(n) thae oupajiaa fir thehaa(n) samaavai
This Shabad by Dhan Dhan Bhai Gurdass Ji explains how the Shabad “Vahiguru” came in to existance and what does it mean. It basically describes the Mahima – praise of Lord Vishnu as a Satgur in Sat Yug by taking the First letter of His Name “Va” in the Shabad “Vahiguru”, then this Shabad describes the Mahima – praise of Lord Krishna as a Satgur in the Dwaaper Yug, Who was and Who is being remembered as HareeKrishna by the masses and this divine name gives us the letter “Hi” of the Shabad “Vahiguru”, then the Shabad describes the Mahima of Lord Ram as a Satgur in the Treta Yug and this divine name gives the letter “Ru” in the Shabad “Vahiguru”, whereas this Shabad descibes the Mahima of Guru Nanak Patshah Ji as a Satgur in the Kal Yug as Gobind – God Nirankaar- gives us the letter “Gu” in the Shabad Vahiguru. This means that the Shabad Vahiguru represents all the Satgurus – Vishnu, Ram, Krishn, and Guru Nanak Patshah Ji from all ages – Sat Yug, Treta Yug, Dwaaper Yug and Kalyug and therefore it is called the Gurmanter – because it represents the Satgurus of all four ages. When we recite the Shabad “Vahiguru” then we infect recite the Mahima – praise of these Satgurus – Vishnu, Ram, Krishan and Guru Nanak Patshah Ji, so this Shabad “Vahiguru” is not the Naam, but it is the Mahima of these Satgurus, the praise of these Satgurus and by reciting the Shabad “Vahiguru” we don’t recite the Naam but we do remember these Satgurus of all four ages, we do recite the praise of these Satgurus. In the end Bhai Gurdass Ji has said that when we recite this Shabad “Vahiguru” then we go back to the Origin, which indirectly means that we reach the salvation. The most important thing to understand here is that Bhai Gurdass Ji have not called the Shabad “Vahiguru” as the Naam, but have called the Shabad “Vahiguru” as Gurmanter, whereas most people understand the Shabad “Vahiguru” as Naam, which is contrary to what Bhai Gurdass Ji have explained in this Shabad. Whereas the Shabad “Sat Naam” has very clearly been defined as a Manter that leads us to the Jivan Mukti and beyond Maya as announced by Dhan Dhan Shri Guru Nanak Patshah Ji in the Mool Manter (explained in an earlier Gur Parsaadee writing). So when we recite the Shabad “Sat Naam Vahiguru” (please note that the Shabad Sat Naam leads the Shabad Vahiguru) it means that “SAT” is the “NAAM” and this Naam is “Dhan Dhan” – the Mahima of all the Satgurus from all four ages – Dhan Dhan Vishnu Ji, Dhan Dhan HareeKrishn Ji, Dhan Dhan Shri Ram Ji and Dhan Dhan Guru Nanak Patshah Ji, so when we recite the Shabad “Sat Naam Vahiguru” then we mean that “SAT” is the “NAAM” and The Satgurus Vishnu, Krishna, Ram and Nanak are the Mahima of this Naam, which means that when we do Sat Naam Vahiguru Simran then we remember the Nirgun Saroop of Akal Purakh and also His Mahima in terms of these Satgurus – Ram, Krishan, Vishnu and Nanak. This also means that the Mahima of Akal Purakh – which are the Satgurus – Vishnu, Ram, Krishan and Nanak is next to the Naam, the Naam came in to existance first and then the Mahima came in to existance, the Akal Purakh came in to existance first, then His Naam came into existance and then the Mahima came in to existance – which means that Naam is bigger than Mahima, the Mahima will lead you to the Naam and then the Naam will lead you to the Akal Purak ( this is exactly what happened to us – started with Vahiguru Simran, then got blessed with the Gur Parsaad of Naam, Puran Bandgi and Seva, so switched to Sat Naam Vahiguru Simran, then Sat Naam Simran, then only SAT Simran and then even SAT disappeared –Namastang Nirnamy as described by Dhan Dhan Dassam Patshah Ji in Jaap Sahib). Some people have misunderstood that we have changed the Gurmanter to Sat Naam, which is not true, Sat is the Naam and Vahiguru is the Gurmanter and that will remain so, nobody can change it, all we have tried to bring out this Puran SAT – divine truth to the masses and nothing else. This doesn’t mean that you can’t meditate on the Shabad Vahiguru, you can continue to do so until you get the Gur Parsaad of Naam, Puran Bandgi and Seva and then as we said you will automatically switch to Sat Naam Vahiguru and so on. So please remove that misunderstanding from your minds and be clear about the eternal divine truth that SAT is the Naam, SAT is the Guru, and Vahiguru is the Gurmanter as described above and signifies the Mahima of Akal Purakh and His Bhagats, the Mahima of Satgur.
FOLLOW UP QUESTION:
One who is blessed with the medicine of the GurMantra, the Name of the Lord, O servant Nanak, does not suffer the agonies of reincarnation. ||5||2||
Somebody was talking to me today on the telephone this morning, and I said, "Yes, yes, there’s no need to be fanatic." He said, "Why not? That’s the way only we live." I said, "All right, my Fanatic Singh ji. Tell me first of all, who’s your isht?" Now it is simple, he’s a Khalsa. He wears three and a half foot long kirpan and all that stuff, and twenty pounds of iron around his whole body. And I just was very honest. I was not putting him down. I said, "What is your isht?" He said, "Guru." I said, "Wrong. Akal Purakh is your isht. You are Akal Moorat. How can Guru be your isht? Who’s apasana you do?" He said, "Akal Purakh." I said, "Then, do you say, ‘Guru Nanak is everything, and God is not?" He said, "No." I said, "Don’t you understand basic rule? Isht is Akal Purakh." He said, "Okay." I said, "Who is your Guru?" Then he was little alert. He said, "Siri Guru Granth." I said, "Siri Guru Granth is what Guru?" He said, "Shabad Guru." I said, "What is your Gurmantra?"
He said, "Wahe Guru." I said, "Who’s Siri Guru Granth’s Guru?" "Shabad Guru." I said, "Do you speak all the time elevating words, lifting words?" He said, "No." I said, "Then how come the Siri Guru Granth is your Guru? Explain to me." "I don’t understand, Sir." I said, "Don’t ‘Sir’ me now. You are a fanatic and I am not, so we have no relationship to this ‘sir-sir’ business. I don’t want to get into this ‘sir’ business. And don’t try buttering me up. I’m asking a simple question to you. You say ‘Siri Guru Granth is my Guru.’ Anybody who believes Siri Guru Granth shall speak elevatingly."
That’s what Siri Guru Granth does. Siri Guru Granth doesn’t do any other thing. It elevates. Whether you are dead or alive, it’s going to elevate you. When we are physically dead, you know what Siri Guru Granth sings? "Anand Bha-i-aa meree maae satiguroo meh paaiaa." Don’t you read that? Last bani is the Kirtan Sohila. "Je ghar kirat aakhee-ai karate kaa ho-eh beechaaro." Can you believe that? This is your Guru. I said, "Okay, Siri Guru Granth is your Guru. Now, you speak elevatingly all the time." He said, "From now I will." I said, "That’s fine. That’s something you have achieved." I said, "What is your Guru Mantra?" He said, "Wahe Guru." "That’s true. Wahe Guru is Guru Mantra." I said, "Do you appreciate everybody?" He said, "Sometimes not." I said, "Then you are nirgura." "Yes." One who chants and recites and who’s Gur Mantra is Wahe Guru, has to do ‘Waho Waho’ for everything, good and bad both. That’s what "Wahe Guru" means. He said, "All right. From today onward I will
do it. I thought I’m not supposed to." I said, "Well you were wrong. Wahe Guru is your Guru mantra." I said, "Then tell me also, what is your ‘tek’ mantra, and what’s your ‘oat’ mantra." He said, "I don’t know what you are saying." I said, "I am talking what you eat and what kind of oats you eat. Do you understand." He said, "No, no, no. I understand ‘oat.’ ‘Oat’ is what you cover with. ‘Tek’ is what you lean on. He said, "It’s too confusing to me." I said, "So be it. I am asking you those two words."
Then he turned around and he said, "What is YOUR oat mantra and tek mantra?" I said, "Simple. Guru Ram Das gave me personally." It happened in a mango garden in New Delhi. I was in a crossroad competition and somebody said to me, "You always say Guru Ram Das is your Guru. Then how come Guru Ram Das does not give you mantra personally?’ That was his what you call it, intention to tell me without a human guru, a guru cannot be. I said, "How come Guru Nanak got the mantra out of the air? Huh? His shabad Guru." He said, "No, no, no, no, no. You’re not Guru Nanak. You’re not this." I said, "Why not? I’m everything. What are you talking about? You are going to tell tomorrow that we don’t represent Guru Gobind Singh, we don’t represent Guru Nanak? We don’t represent his house?" I said, "We are the representatives. We are him." "Oh no, no, no. Not in that sense, but in that sense." I said, "Now you are talking senses." But I said, "All right, if that is your dispute, and you don’t
want me to understand. I’ll give you the answer tomorrow."
And next day, instead of that altar, Guru Ram Das was there sitting himself as a pure full structure of light. And instead of chanting ‘Wahe Guru’ which is my mantra, which is Gur Mantra which I was chanting, I began chanting ‘Guru Guru Wahe Guru Guru Ram Das Guru.’ And I said, "Sahib, what is this?" He said, "Go and tell the fool that you got it. That’s it." And, "Wahe Guru Ji Ka Khalsa, Wahe Guru Ji Ki Fateh!"
I came back. I said, "Hey, I want you to stand up." He said, "Why?" I said, "I want to touch your feet. I want to bow at your feet." He said, "No, yesterday you yelled at me." I said, "That was yesterday. Don’t remember yesterday. Today I want to bow to you then I’ll tell you what it is." He said, "No, no, I’m afraid." Because he was afraid I was going to catch him from his knees, I’m going to throw him down. Because day before I was very mad at him that as a holy man he’s doing ugly things. So I was really telling him not to do. But anyway, he was very afraid that day. He thought I was going to catch him from the knees and turn him upside down and he’ll fall flat. I said, "No, no, don’t worry about it. That’s your thought. I won’t do it. I just really honestly want to lie down and bow at your feet." He said, "All right, you do it from a distance. You can’t come near me." I said, "If you are that afraid, I don’t mind." So I, where I was, I lied down and I just did
it. I said, "Thank you very much." He said, "Now tell me what happened." I said, "I saw Guru Ram Das, in person, in light. I’m grateful to you… and I got the mantra you wanted."
Now, that’s called ‘tek.’ "
gur ma(n)thra avakhadhh naam dh eenaa jan naanak sa(n)katt jon n paae ||5||2||
The problem here is that unless you take a deeper dive in to the Braham Gyan you will not be able to understand the true divine meaning of any Shalok of Gurbani (you will not be able to take a deep dive in to the Mansarovar and understand the true deep divine meaning unless you have physically achieved the status described in the Shalok). Using the explanation given by the steak writer doesn’t let you feel the depth of the Shabad, none of the Shalok’s can be understood unless physically experienced by you with a deep dive in to the Mansarovar, none of the Shalok’s can be explained in a few words as written by steak writers (were the steak writers or are the steak writers Braham Gyanis, did they physically experienced what is written in the Gurbani? Is a big question? Can anybody answer this question?) The steak writers have just given literal meaning of the Gurbani with no divine feeling of the depth of the Mansarovar, because the source of the Braham Gyan is the Mansarovar, unless you physically reach the Mansarovar – Gur Sagar – Nirgun Saroop how can you try to take a deep dive in to the Gyan Saroop – Gurbani.
Let us take a little bit deeper dive in to this Shalok: here the Gur Manter (two Shabads with the meaning as explained earlier) is called the “Naam” and only the Gur Manter of Naam can cure you of all the sicknesses – and what are these sicknesses – Panj Doots: Kaam, Krodh, Lobh, Moh and Ahankaar; desires- Asa Trishna Mansha (Rajo and Tamo attributes of Maya form the basis of these mental sicknesses), and these mental sicknesses lead to physical ailments, and what can cure all these ailments is the Gur Manteer of Naam, and once we are cured of these mental sicknesses then we will be relieved of the biggest sorrow of the birth and death, which means we will become Jivan Mukt – achieve salvation. So it has been very clearly explained that the Gur Manter is the Naam and Naam will lead us to salvation. If we take a little more deeper dive in to the Mansarovar then we will get a little bit more glimpse of the divine wisdom that where do we get the Naam – Jan is the source of Naam and Akal Purakh is addressing Dhan Dhan Guru Nanak Patshah that the Jan is the source of Naam, which is the Gur Manter, and which will make you pure and pious by relieving you of the shackles of Maya, which will lead you to salvation and save you from recycling through the biggest sorrow of birth and death. So with that said, this one line Shabad has the Puran Gyan in itself – it is telling you how can you achieve salvation (compare this glimpse of the Mansarovar, which if you have physically achieved, with the explanation given by the steak writer and you will find the difference between the depth of the Mansarovar earned as divine wisdom and the shallowness of the presentation by the steak writer)
dhukh kalaes n bho bi aapai gur ma(n)thra hiradhai h oe ||
The meaning of Gur Manter is same as explained in the above Shalok. This Shalok as well gives us a glimpse of the Mahima of Naam, whch is the Gur Manter (not the shabad Vahiguru as explained by Bhai Gurdass J), when Naam goes in to Hirda, that is the stage when we become fearless and the fear of death is gone, fear of anything is gone and we get relieved of all the sorrows and pains, and these sorrows and pains are the mental sicknesses as explained earlier under the operation of a Maya, when Naam goes in to Hirda then the salvation is achieved, Mukti from Maya is achieved. Again the key here is not to confuse the Shabad Vahiguru with the Gur Manter of Naam. So when the Gur Manter of Naam the Gur Parsaad of Naam goes in to Hirda and the Hirda “SAT” Sarovar is illuminated, this internal source of Amrit is activated and the Hirda Kamal becomes in full blossom, then Maya is conquered completely, the soul goes beyond Maya, Trihu Gun Tey Parey – beyond three attributes of Maya and the soul merges in the Nirgun Saroop. This is a very high spiritual stage – Karam Khand and Sach Khand. Naam goes in to Hirda in Karam Khand then the Bandgi goes higher and in to the Sach Khand when a complete control over Maya is achieved and the soul gets liberated of the influence or operation of the Maya and goes back to the Nirgun Saroop.
kahu naanak gur ma(n)thra ch ithaar ||
This is another Hukam of Dhan Dhan Paar Braham Parmesar to replace the mind by the Gur Manter of Naam as explained earlier. Akal Purakh is addressing Guru Nanak Patshah Ji (These divine words came from the Guru Patshah Ji, but look at the Nimrata – humbleness and humility of the Guru Sahibans, they gave all the Wadyaee to the Akal Purakh, whereas Akal Purakh gives all the wadyaaee to the Sants and Bhagats, the Sants and Bhagats keep on giving the wadyaaee to the Akal Purakh Himself, this happens when there is no haumai left, then the all the praises are for the Guru and Akal Purakh – Kaho Nanak Sabh Teri Wadyaaee Koi Nao Naa Janey Mera) when the mind is replaced by the Naam then the divine sixth sense takes over and all five senses come under the divine Hukam, and when that happens then there is salvation achieved, so there is a Gur Parsaad of Naam, Naam Simran, Puran Bandgi and Seva hidden in each one of these Shaloks, and you can feel this Puran Tatt Gyan only when you have actually physically experienced this happening to you. Another way of explaining it is that whatever Guru Sahibans experienced physically was recited by them, which was then put in to writing.
kahu naanak gur ma(n)thra dhr irraaeiaa ||
This is another Hukam of Dhan Dhan Paar Braham Parmesar, which states about the implanting of the Gur Manter of Naam in the Surat, Hirda and all the “SAT” Sarovars and in Rom Rom. This again leads us to the Gur Parsaad of Naam, Naam Simran, Puran Bandgi and Seva then only this Hukam is carried out in full.
har maarag saadhhoo dhas iaa japeeai gurama(n)th ||
This is the Hukam about where will you get the Gur Parsaad of Naam, Naam Simran, Puran Bandgi and Seva – only a Sadhu, the one who is one with God, who is beyond Maya, can help you get the Gur Parsaad. The Shabad Gur Manter refers to the Gur Parsaad of Naam, Naam Simran, Puran bandgi and Seva. Whatever you may look at in the Gurbani, when you go to go deeper in to the divine meanings you end up in the Mansarovar – Nirgun Saroop, Param Jyot Puran Parkash – Hari Marag – passage to Sach Khand is identified and lead in the Sat Sangat of a Sadhu, a Sadhu is the one who has straightened out His Hirda, made it a Khalas Hirda, pure Hirda, a Sant Hirda and filled it with all the divine qualities, so the Shabad Sadhu takes us deep in to the Mansarovar, the Shabad Hari Marag takes us deep in to the Mansarovar, Japnaa takes us deep in to the Mansarovar, Gur Mantar takes us deep in to the Mansarovar, every Hukam leads us ultimately to the depths of the Mansarovar, every Shabad takes us deep in to the depths of the Mansarovar – Nirgun Saroop of Akal Purakh.
chalath baisath sovath jaa gath gur ma(n)thra ridhai chithaar ||
This Hukam leads us to Rom Rom Naam Simran – Ajapaa Jaap Naam Simran, physically it is not possible to keep on doing Naam Simran while walking, sitting, sleeping and at all times, but when we go in to Ajapaa Jaap and Rom Rom Naam Simran then only this Hukam is achieved. So again this Hukam is talking us to the depths of the Mansarovar, this can happen only when you are saturated with Amrit in the Mansarovar. So achieveing every Shabad leads us to the salvation and again this is all Gur Parsaad of the Gur Manter of Naam, Naam Simran, Puran Bandgi and Seva that will take us to the heights of the spiritual world as described in this Hukam.
chahu dhis foo l rehee bikhiaa bikh g ur ma(n)thra mookh garurraaree ||
The poison of corruption is flowering forth in the four directions; I have taken the GurMantra as my antidote
This Shabad is talking about the Maya – Bikhiaa is the Maya – poison of Maya eating the entire world, that is why the current age is called deep darkness – or called dark age – Kal yug is at full blossom – Maya is operating at its peak in this dark age and our Karni wrapped in the scum of Maya is causing us to drink this poison on a continuous basis, and the Amrit is the Gur Manter of Naam, Naam Simran, Puran Bandgi and Seva, which can help us break through this dark scum of the Maya and go beyond the Maya and back to the Origin. Si this Shalok describes the current situation we are in and how can we get out of this darkness of Maya and go in to the Puran Parkash – Nirgun Saroop. This divine Hukam is again telling us how can we go and touch the depths of the Mansarovar with the Gur Parsaad of the Gur Manter of Naam, Naam Simran, Puran Bandgi and Seva.
So the bottom line is that the Shabad Gur Manter used in these Shaloks doesn’t mean the Shabad “Vahiguru” as described by Bhai Gurdass Ji, but it means the Gur Parsaad of Naam, Naam Simran, Puran Bandgi and Seva. All the above divine Hukams lead us to the depths of the Mansarovar, which can only happen through the Gur Parsaad of Naam, Naam Simran, Puran Bandgi and Seva.
thankyou for all the time you spend answering our questions. I suppose what I am really trying to understand is when people believe in a past master/prophet/guru and offer their prayers to them – does it work? Those people seem to believe it does, and the exmaple of yogi ji is that he saw his beloved guru ram das ji in light form and was blessed. And you also have praeyed in the past for darshan of guru ji’s charan in your hirda and been blessed with darshan too and been blessed accordingly. And myself too always used to pray to guru nanak ji and felt he was guiding me too. I think its same for Christians too, and hindus with their devi devtas. Everybody is praying to some aspect of God represented by their past master.
Who won’t like to have Darshans of the Guru Sahians, Braham Gyanis and Sants and Bhagats, but we also know that all the Ten Guru Sahibans used to be sitting above our head when we used to sit in long Smadhees early on in the Bangi stages. These kinds of experiencees bring in confidence and trust in your Bandgi and you get more and more motivated to move ahead with enhancing devotion, love, trust, commitment, belief and faith, which helps a lot.
So what I understand is that those prayers do work. Do you agree?
It all depends on how dedicated you are, how much you have surrendered yourself to the Guru with respect to the Tunn Munn and Dhan, His advancement towards you depends upon your own self –but one thing for sure if you take one step he will for sure take 10 million steps towards you, and imagine if you take all the steps towards Hm by giving Tunn Munn and Dhan to Him, complete surrender to Him – that is what is Dhiaanaa, then what will happen to you?
But what is missing is that you wont get salvation that way. For that you need naam from the living light of God in the heart of the saint. Do you agree?
That is an absolute truth, all Guru Sahibans have been through the same passage, except Guru Nanak Patshah Ji who was blessed by the God – God was His Guru, and there is one in ages who is so fortunate to be born to be blessed directly by the God, and the Dassam Patshah Ji who was blessed by the God as well – Ab Hum Apni Katha Bakhano Tap Sadhat Kin Vidh Mohey Aano, He also had the eternal blessings of Guru Tegh Bahadur Patshah Ji as well being His father. With the Satguru the Bandgi becomes very easy and faster provided you completely surrender yourself to the Satgur and there are some fortunate ones who go through the Puran Bandgi and become Puran Braham Gyanis. It is not only the Naam, it is the Gur Parsaad of Naam, Naam Simran, Puran Bandgi and Seva that are most important aspects of the Puran Bandgi.
I did ask Prtam Anand Ji something similar, that all kinds of people see the light, have spiritual expereinces etc etc, so what is the difference between them and us? He said they dont get mukti. Which made it very clear.
The real Mukti is achieving Jivan Mukti while being alive and living on this earth and still having everyday life and help others achieve the Jivan Mukti. Mukti doesn’t come after the body dies, it has to come while you are breathing, there is no Mukti after death of the body, winning over the Maya has to be while breathing and living in the world and not after death.One thing more very important to mention here is that we should not look at others, but should concentrate on your ownself, because that is what matters the most.
Also last night faced a long grilling by old friend and his blessed dad, did dandauth to his dad at the end he is dhan dhan, obviously they feel i have cut my hair and gone off the tracks. Dad joined in with his nindya of baba ji, whilst almost crying, mum was getting very upset, sister was on the borderline, but satnaam satguru baba ji was with u and statyed mostly calm and kept washing their feet telling 100% Truth, in the end sister and i did dandauth to uncle ji, and he hgave us big hugs.
This is good, bearing on face Ninday is good, it is preparing you for increasing your tolerance power to bear more Nindya in future to come, Nindya is a Gur Parsaad, it will eventually kill all your Haumai, No Maan no Apmaan for a Sant.
Thanks a zillion times to the Guru and Akal Purakh Ji for giving us your Sangat. It has been a great experience to have you all in the Sat Naam Parivaar.
Ik Oankaar Sat Naam Satgur Parsaad
Dhan Dhan Gur-Guru-Satgur-Gurbani-Sat Naam – Sat Sangat
Guru Pyare Jee Bhagat Jee:
Kottan Kot Dandaut and Shukrana Parvaan Karna Ji
God bless you with the Tatt Gyan, Braham Gyan, all the eternal treasures, God Bless you and make you Sach Di Takdi
ikoankar satnaam gurprasad
dandauth bandana ji
what you have described is not consistent.
Let us try to understand the inconsistancy you are talking about, it is really good to talk about it and be clear before publishing anything, we have always liked you to edit the messages before posting, you have been doing a great job by doing so, your service have been just incredible and you deserve all the appreciation for what you have been doing, your thirst for the divine truth have been excellent, please continue to do so.
Basically you have accepted that when Bhai Gurdas ji uses the word Gurmantr he is refrerring to Waheguru and that is praise of the SatGurus of all ages.
It is not a question of our acceptance, this is a general consenses among the Sikh Sangat as stated by some writers as well as some Braham Gyanis, as far as we are concerned we have just read some of Bhai Sahib Ji Gurdass Ji’s Bani, so acceptance or non acceptance is not the criteria of making any judgement, we are no one to pass a judgement on Bhai Gurdass Ji’s Bani, this is just an effort to bring out the divine meaning of the Shabad “Vahiguru” as what Bhai Gurdass Ji have stated in his Bani, whereas Shabad “Vahiguru” is a part of Gurbani, we have just tried to explain it to the masses in order for them to understand the meaning of the Shabad “Vahiguru” as stated by Bhai Gurdass Ji, as well as understand the meaning of Shabad “SAT NAAM” as stated by Bhai Gurdass Ji and in Gurbani, again this is not our understanding or explanation, but it is as stated by Bhai Gurdass Ji. Even in context to the Gurbani whatever we have tried to explain in all the articles so far is whatever Gurbani says and whatever have happened to us in all physical divine senses, whatever we have experienced, there is nothing known to us as our understanding, in fact it is not appropriate to use the word “understanding”, this is HAUMAI, it is ONLY THE Gur Parsaad that makes these things happen, and the same Gur Parsaad made Bhai Gurdass Ji to write His Bani, it is beyond the word acceptance or understanding, it is a lot more beyond the acceptance and underatanding, acceptance and understanding words are used under the influence of Maya, Gur Parsaad is beyond Maya, Divine Knowledge can’t be understood or accepted, there is no logic in this path of divinity, whatever the Guru says is “SAT Vachans”, it can be practiced and earned and converted to Divine Wisdom with the Gur Parsaad, every Shabad is a Hukam and follow the Hukam and become wiser divinely or gain the Divine Wisdom and not by accepting or understanding under the influence of logic – Maya, Maya is logic, Gur Parsaad is beyond Maya and logic, we fail miserabley when we start looking at the acceptance criteria and logic, that is what has happened to so many people around us who have been thrown down the cliff because they started to find a logic somewhere on the way inspite of tasting the truth physically, Divine Wisdom doesn’t come by reading books or Gurbani, Braham Gyan is a Gur Parsaad and comes only after winning the Maya completely, Tatt Gyan comes only after winning the Maya and winning the Maya is a Gur Parsaad, so where is the question of trying to find a logic in the Braham Gyan.
You have also previously in the Satnaam var 1 article that Bhai Gurdas ji is the key to understanding gurbani.
Again this is not our word or our understanding or our logic, these are very small words to use for the Braham Gyan, where there is a Braham Gyan there should be no questions, Braham Gyan is a Puran SAT so where is the question for reasoning or logic. This is a general consenses amongst the Sikh Sangat and also as stated by some of the Braham Gyanis, and if that is true then where is the question of acceptance or understanding, there are no such words that are appropriate to be used against the Braham Gyan.
And you have said that the word Gur Mantr in gurbani refers to Naam of Akal Purkah – the SatNaam, and not the Waheguru praise of the SatGurus … which is what gurbani says is 100% right.
Bhai Gurdass Ji’s Bani is the Key to the Gurbani and he has explained the meanings of Shabad “SAT Naam” and “Vahiguru” in his Bani. This doesn’t undermine either the divine meaning of these Shabads as explained by Bhai Sahib Ji and the Gurbani. We have just tried to explain these Shabads as stated by Bhai Gurdass Ji and Gurbani based on our own physical experiences.
You see the problem, word Gurmantr is defined as the Naam and you agree. It is not defined as WAheguru in Gurbani, hence Sikhs go to Bhai Gurdas ji to understand as he is the key and he says it is WAheguru.
We don’t see any problem – you will always see a lot of problems when you start looking at the Braham Gyan under the influence of Maya. It is so simple – In Gurbani Gur Manter is Naam, Gurbani preaches Naam Simran and Gur Manter is Naam, Bhai Gurdass Ji has explained the Shabad “Vahiguru” as presented in the Gurbani as well as Shabad “Sat Naam” as presented in Gurbani and called the Shabad “Vahiguru” as Gur Manter, and according to His explanations these are two different Shabads with different divine meanings and that is what he has explained as discussed in these two articles we have written with the Gur Parsaad. This doesn’t stop anybody from meditating on the Shabad “Vahiguru”. But keep in mind – which gives the definition of the infinite – Shabad “Vahiguru” or Shabad “Sat Naam”?,which is bigger and complete – Shabad “Vahiguru” or the Mool Manter?
Gurmantr cant equal Waheguru in Bhai gurdas ji’s vars but in Gurbani it equals SAtNAAM? That is not a convincing argument, that is a big hole in the article.
Are you still looking for a logic or an argument? Both are Gur Manters so both are equal? Look at the definition of Shabad “Vahiguru” and the Mool Manter – do you still think they are equal? Shabad “Vahiguru” is the Mahima of Mool Manter, Mool Manter defines the Creator and Shabad “Vahiguru” is the Creation – which is bigger Creator or the Creation? Do you still think there is a big hole or the holehave been filled already? Both the divine Shabads are unquestionable, are they? So the best thing is to meditate on the Shabad “Vahiguru” and see the rewards and then meditate on Shabad “Sat Naam” and then see the rewards, unless you physically experience the difference you may still not find it convincing or you may still see a hole somewhere in there?
Some scholars say that these Waheguru Vars have been added to Bhai Gurdas ji’s teachings, just as people aslo argue about raga maalaa.
Why do we have to go about what people say, people say a lot of things, people practice a lot of things different than what you have been through in past four years, do you see any difference between them and you? Do you see any difference between what you were four years back and what you are now? Why do you want to get in to these controversies? These will just do nothing but will distract you from the focus, if you want to read just read Gurbani and practice Gurbani.
At the end of the day I got confused with not knowing the Truth and Baba ji has said that SATnaam is the mool mantr, the beej mantr, the gurmantr, the maha mantr it is everything. And trying to convince Sikhs otherwise using bhai gurdas ji’s vars isnt going to work.
Whatever Baba Ji has said is an absolute divine truth and nothing less then that, and if that is true then where is a space for any confusion, argument, logic, understanding, acceptance? And we are not trying to convince anybody for that matter, we are just trying to bring out what is the meaning of Shabad “Vahiguru” and Shabad “SAT Naam” as explained by Bhai Gurdass Ji and as presented in the Gurbani based on our own practicle physical experiences. Do you think that we can really convince anybody? That will be HAUMAI. Specially, when it is a Gur Parsaad, it is destiny and nothing else. Our destiny is what we are trying to do and their destiny is whatever they (people) are doing. Whosoever is destined to get the Gur Parsaad will get it, whosoever is destined to benefit will benefit from it.
Your explanation of the tuks was excellent. Thankyou.
We deeply appreciate you bringing this out – it will benefit everyone who reads it.
What do you think?
We hope we were able to clear your doubts and illusions, please let us know if you have any more questions or concerns. We appreciate with all the humbleness your deeper digging in to whatever we write, it is termendous help, we take it as a Gur Parsaad – your Sangat is a Gur Parsaad for us. Please continue to do so with open heart.
Apologies for being so ignorant of divine wisdom.
Nothing to apologise for, excellent comments and concerns, good to remove the confusion and get out of the argument than to remain stuck. Our head will always remain under the dust of your feet for your love for the divine truth and desire to serve the people with whatever you learn and earn.
dust of your feet
your Slave forever – Dassan Dass
|vaahigur oo guroo ma(n)thr hai jap ho umai(n) khoee|||
|His Guru-manta is Vahiguru, whose recitation erases egotism.|
|vaahigur oo gur shabadh lai piram piaa laa chup chalolaa|||
The Guru’s word he receives is Vahiguru, the wondrous Lord, and remains silently immersed in delight.
|Bhai Gurdaas Ji |
Vaars Bhai Gurdaas
|vaahigur oo saalaahanaa gur shabadh alaa eae ||aa|||
Vahiguru, God, is eulogised through recitation of the Word of the Guru, Gurbani.
|Bhai Gurdaas Ji |
Vaars Bhai Gurdaas
|vaedh kathaeb agochar aa vaahiguroo gu r shabadh sunaayaa|||
The Gurus recited Word-Guru as Vahiguru who is beyond the Vedas and Katebas (the semtic scriptures).
|Bhai Gurdaas Ji |
Vaars Bhai Gurdaas
DHAN DHAN GUR-GURU-SATGUR-GURBANI-SAT SANGAT-SAT NAAM
God bless you with Puran Braham Gyan.
dandauth bandhana ji
yes you are right ji, this verse only mentions waheguru as being mantr! which makes much more sense with what you have described with gurprasad. Couple of other things when I used to read this verse I took it to mean that VAHIGURU was the naam for now. Why? Because I took each line to say that each age had its own satguru who brought his own naam that was repeated. But as the Age changed, the Guru changed and the naam changed. And the Guru for now was Guru nanak dev ji, the naam for now was WAHEGURU. But that doesnt make sense because it says Nanak is the Guru and Gobind is recited ..so where does waheguru come into it.
Naam doesn’t change with time, it has been so forever and will remain so for ever – Aad Sach Jugaad Sach Hai Bhi Sach Nanak Hosi Bhi Sach – that is why it is “SAT”, it is same for the entire creation (it is same for Christians, for Budhis, for Sikhs, for Hindus, for Muslims and for everybody and every creation), other names are Kirtam names given by the Gurus, Sants and Bhagats, about the Shabad Gobind used in this verse by Bhai Gurdass Ji – there is no difference between Nanak and Gobind – Guru Nanak Patshah Ji and Guru Gobind Singh Patshah Ji – and Gobind is also a Kirtam name of Akal Purakh and in Kalyug it signifies the Satguru of Kalyug (it is believed that Guru Nanak Patshah Ji have 84 Avtaars, all have not yet appeared in the world), that is what is described in the Shabad Vahiguru. Now you are getting in to the depth of the Mansarovar – keep it up.
It does seem though bhai gurdas ji is saying that each Guru of each age brought their own kirtam naam eg Har Har, Ram Ram , Vasdev, Gobind Gobind, and that is what Bhai Gurdas Ji is explaining. And WAHEGURU is the combination of the praise names which also start with the same letters. WAHGURU isnt the combination of the Satguru’s names as it would be "N" for Nanak instead of G for Gobind.
Shabad Vahiguru is the Mahima of these Satgurus – and Mahima of the Satgurus is the Mahima of Akal Purakh – all Sants, Bhagats, Satgurus, Braham Gyanis are the Mahima of Akal Purakh – they represent the Akal Purakh and there is no difference between the Akal Purakh and them.
However the Sikhs will still say that in another verse bhai gurdas ji has written tht WAHEGURU GUR MANTR HA….actually I have just looked up this shabad too http://www.sikhitothemax.com/page.asp?ShabadID=5833 and bhai gurdas ji actually says
"WAHEGURU GUROO MANTR HA" ..waheguru is the guru mantr , not the gur mantr!!!!!! All these years I’ve been quoting it wrong, and the AKJ and kirtanis have been singing it wrong – it is the GURU mantr ..it is the mantra the praises the GURUs just as you have described. WOW ! This is a really eye opening moment for me.
|vaahigur oo guroo ma(n)thr hai jap ho umai(n) khoee|||
|His Guru-manta is Vahiguru, whose recitation erases egotism.|
And without a Guru ego never goes, but praising the GURUs GURU i.e. personal form of God becomes everything and ego becomes nothing.
This is how the meaning of Gurbani changes as you progress in your spirituality from Dharam Khand to Gyan Khand to Saram Khand to Karam Khand and then to Sach Khand. This happens with the Gur Parsaad of Naam, Naam Simran, Puran Bandgi and Seva. So this is what is the actual physical experiences that make the difference, and when you go in to higher realms of divine eternal truth then you discover these hidden treasures.
Your explanation is an absolute truth – Shabad Vahiguru is the Guru Manter and not the Naam. The Gur Parsaad of Naam is very difficult to handle for beginers (please read the article on the Naam Daan Practices of the Braham Gyanis we wrrote a while back, which explains how some of the Braham Gyanis use to administer Naam to the desciples), because it is so powerful and puts you on a real fast divine track with all the physical spiritual experiences and tests of Maya come in hard, that is exactly what happened to a lot of people – they went up so fast and then when the tests of Maya came in they failed miserably, so that is the reason why the Braham Gyanis will tell you to do Vahiguru Jaap for a long time and then will give the Gur Parsaad to a few ones who are ready to handle the Gur Parsaad or the ones who have a lot of Bandgi in their past lives.
Here are some other quotes by bhai gurdas ji about waheguru. He calls it the GUR SHABAD ..what does that mean?
All these verses highlight Vahiguru as “Gur Shabad” – and that is an absolute divine truth, because Shabad Vahiguru is a part of the Gurbani – and Gurbani is the language of Akal Purakh – story of Akal Purakh – Akath Ki Katha – Mahima of Akal Purakh, Mahima of Naam, Mahima of Sants and Bhagats, Satgurus and Braham Gyanis, Sadh and Jan. So it is the Mahima and not the Naam – it has emanated from Naam, it is the Mahima of Naam. For that matter the entire Gurbani is a Gur Shabad. But the the Gur Shabad “Vahiguru” contains the Mahima of the Satgurus of all four ages and when we recite the Shabad “Vahiguru” we remember the Satgurus of all four ages – Vishnu, Ram, Harikrishna, and Nanak (Guru Nanak Patshah Ji to to Guru Gobind Singh Ji Patshah Ji). We have also seen copies of the some original Hukam Namas of various Guru Sahibans (published in a book) where they have preached to the common Sangat – Guru Guru Japna. Again everybody didn’t get Naam from the Guru Sahibans, probably there were a few fortunate ones who were blessed with the Gur Parsaad of Naam, Naam Simran, Puran Bandgi and Seva.
And also , why did we need another praise name like WAHEGURU at all? Is it like when baba ji told jasbir pajee in the beginning do joria dee seva and recite waheguru waheguru , and when his ego subsided then he got the naam? Was waheguru given first to newcomers to get their love and devotion for the satguru upto 100%, so they were ready then to love God the Truth – 100%..step1 =Guru connection, waheguru, step 2 = God connection -satnaam?
You are absolutely right. Vahiguru is the first step and the Naam – Sat Naam is the Gur Parsaad and is the laddle that leads you and takes you to the SAT – Nirgun Saroop and merges you with the Nirgun – and there is no Naam at that level, when you merge in the Akal Purakh then there remains no Naam – that is why we went through this sequence: Vahiguru – Sat Naam Vahiguru – Sat Naam – Ik Oankaar Sat Naam – Sat – and then nothing.
Finally, what does WAHEGURU JI KA KHALSA …. mean? By putting JI after WAHEGURU it is repecting the word WAHEGURU as a praise name of God, not just DHAN DHAN?
The meaning of the Shabad Vahiguru has already been as explained by Bhai Gurdass Ji and it signifies the praise – so in short you can say Dhan Dhan – or if you want to go deeper and to a longer version then it is the praise – Mahima of Satgurus in all four ages as described by Bhai Gurdass Ji. The divine meaning of the Shabad Khalsa, have already been explained several times – which is a Puran Braham Gyani. So this Fateh means that Khalsa – a Puran Braham Gyani is Dhan Dhan and is a winner – and winner of what? The winner ofMaya, the winner of Panj Doots and Asa Trishna Mansha – desires, the winner of His mind, the winner of the 14 Lok Parlok, the winner of the internal compliance, the winner of the Puran Sachyari Rehat – Anderli Rehat –internal compliance. So this Fateh means the Mahima of the Puran Braham Gyani – praise of a Puran Braham Gyani.
dust of your feet
Your Seva is Dhan Dhan, please keep it up. You are one of the rare ones who have been blessed with this Gur Parsaad.